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Incy Wincy Spider

For more infomation >> Incy Wincy Spider Nursery Rhymes | Cartoons for Kids by Little Treehouse - Duration: 1:00:13.

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嗯哼天生鏡頭感，隨便一個表情都能蓋過霍思燕、杜江的風頭 - Duration: 3:39.

For more infomation >> 嗯哼天生鏡頭感，隨便一個表情都能蓋過霍思燕、杜江的風頭 - Duration: 3:39.

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[Interview] Baptiste Tavernier - From France to Tokyo's International Budo University (Part 1/2) - Duration: 30:15.

An interview with Baptiste Tavernier, Budoka, artist and writer.

Baptiste Tavernier, born 1981 in France pursues a creative path

that has led him from experimental music through the martial arts of Japan

to the painters canvas.

He discovered Budo at the age of eight

when he joined his local judo club.

while studying digital art and musicology in college

he started practicing a rather rare martial art

called Bozendo in France in 1999.

He left for Japan in 2006

and joined the International Budo University for 8 years.

where he focused on the study of modern Budo

and traditional Bujutsu.

He is now a Renshi sixth Dan in Tankendo,

fourth Dan in Jukendo and Naginata,

second Dan in Battodo, Sho Dan in Buzendo,

and has some experience in Aikido, Judo,

Tendoryu Naginatajutsu, Tatsumi Ryu Heiho

and Isshin-ryu Naginatajutsu.

Deeply involved in the international diffusion of Jukendo and Tankendo,

he is now the chairman of the All Japan Jukendo Federation's International Committee.

He regularly writes articles in the Kendo World magazine

and has published a book on Miyamoto Musashi's Heiho Sanjugo Kajo,

the 35 articles of swordsmanship

that precedes the famous Book of Five Rings.

Baptiste currently lives in Taipei,

where he teaches Jukendo and Tankendo

and develops his creative work.

He has exhibited in Tokyo, Hong Kong,

Miami, Taipei, Rotterdam and many other cities.

During one of his numerous trips to Japan,

this time on the occasion of the Kendo World annual Keiko Kai,

he accepted our invitation

and we met in early August 2017 for this interview.

So, my... the decision...

well, it is not really a decision to start martial arts, It's a...

a process rather common in France I would say.

Well, at least in France.

There are many children who are...

more or less presented with the choice of doing either football or Judo

I started when I was, say, 7 or 8 years old, I don't remember exactly...

But I practiced Judo for about 10 years,

maybe a little less...

with a really great teacher whose name was...

well, actually is, Olivier Arnaud

who was my first Sensei, put in big words.

I did that for a while, untill I was a teenager,

Then what was important was the break I had,

when I was about 16 or 15 years old

I stopped all judo and martial arts activities,

untill I went to college.

And actually, it's when I started college that I finally thought:

"I actually miss it, not doing judo anymore,

I would like..."

I don't know, there was some kind of emptiness

and I really wanted to get into Judo again,

except that... after all, there's not only Judo in life,

so I thought maybe it's an opportunity to try something new.

At the time I was in Montpellier actually, and...

right next to the university in Montpellier,

there was a "Bozendo" club,

and probably nobody knows what it is.

A long time ago,

maybe a hundred years ago,

maybe 80 years ago,

a French sailor who was on a mission in China

learned battling techniques with a stick,

during his missions,

and after that, he did one or two missions,

let's say he stayed in Japan a couple of times,

when he learned Aikido,

and when he came back to France,

he blended Aikido with the stick battling techniques he had learned in China,

and he actually created his own mix...

which in the end is pretty interesting,

I must say, it's a, it's a....

a martial art which is...

which is a synthesis, really, which is absolutely not...

which is not from a traditional Japanese lineage or anything but,

it's a very good synthesis and I learnt a lot,

I have good memories of Bozendo.

I practiced for at least 3, 4 years, maybe a little more...

and finally, when I moved to Paris, I...

I started practicing Naginata.

That's it.

So, when I came to Paris,

it was to finish my studies, actually, I was...

I did musicology,

I was taking my DEA, and then my thesis.

In Paris there was no Bozendo at all,

it's something that you can only find in the South of France.

So for a year or two,

with a former Bozendo mate,

we trained together,

at the Bois de Boulogne, he he he...

It was quite funny...

I remember once there was...

a group of Japanese tourists

who visited the outskirts of the wood.

Obviously, not the... deeper parts,

and... the poor guys were probably astonished to see two...

two "Gaijin" wearing Hakama,

hitting and beating each other with wooden sticks

They watched us for about 15 minutes.

It was exotism at the Bois de Boulogne.

Well anyway,

there were only the two of us, and...

my friend was more hooked on Korean stuff at the time,

he was more into the Hapkido, that kind of stuff, so finally, well...

we kind of... not give up but...

we saw each other less often...

And so, I was looking for something that could replace Bozendo in Paris.

And that's when I remembered about Naginata.

Well, I didn't really know what Naginata was all about.

I just knew it was a Japanese martial art

with relatively long weapons.

And so I told myself naively

that it will be probably more or less like the Bozendo,

and that my experience...

well, rather my few years of practice,

would probably make it easier for me to blend in quickly

So I grabbed a... phonebook

because it was back in those days when Internet was...

brand new, so phonebooks still existed,

and I phoned the lady who used to take care of Naginata,

called Simone Charton,

who actually was the woman who introduced Naginata almost all over Europe

She is the one who got it several decades ago from Japan

and brought it back to France,

from where it spread to Belgium...

She insisted so much over the phone,

I couldn't get rid of her,

so after two hours I said:

"OK, all right, I promise, I'll come next Monday (or Tuesday, I don't remember),

I'm positive, I promise, I'll come."

... and that's how I started Naginata.

It's thank to that, actually, that I finally came to Japan,

Because after two or three years of practice of Naginata in France,

where I met a lot of people in Europe...

because there are a lot of… it's like Kendo actually...

There are Naginata competitions

so it's an opportunity to meet practitioners from other countries,

so much so that I could picture myself going to Japan for a month or two,

in order to improve.

At the time, the president of the European federation of Naginata

was Mr. Kondo, Kondo Tadahiko.

who lived in Paris full time.

He does not practice himself

but he has a very good knowledge of martial arts

because he has been involved in this circle for many years.

And he organized a lot of meetings in France with the French practitioners,

meetings during which people could train with many Sensei

but in many disciplines, not only Naginata. In...

in Kendo, or even older disciplines like Katori Shinto-ryu etc, etc.

And so one day he told me: "There is, actually...

in Katsu-ura, in Chiba Prefecture,

there is a university were it is possible to practice martial arts full time.

You're supposed to enlist for a one-year programme,

but I can ask to the Naginata Federation,

International and Japanese,

to actually invite you over

and you can spend a year training there...

without actually being part of the official program."

And so he's the one that made the arrangement.

So, I think we were in the month of... I don't know... May? Someting like that.

It was the end of the school year.

I was in the second year of my thesis I think,

and I said: "Ok, let's do this, when do I sign?"

So he said: "Now, but you have to go in September."

So I thought about it for a couple of hours

and I thought: "Well whatever, let's drop the thesis half way... er...

I can still hear my parents, my grand-parents protesting.

That's too bad...

So I said: "Let's do this, let's go to Japan

and practice Naginata for one year,

and we'll see what happens."

So the International Budo University or...

"I.B.U." as it's often called,

or "Kokusai Budo Daigaku",

It's in... Katsu-ura.

It's basically a fishing village

where there was nothing forty years ago,

And they thought: "Great!

Land is cheap,

let's build an annexe for the Nippon Budokan,

let's build the... the training hall for the Nippon Budokan.

For those who don't know,

the Nippon Budokan is the organization that...

actually it's more or less the headquarters of martial arts...

in Japan.

It sounds a little pompous, but...

that's the idea.

And so they built their training centers there.

Then followed the idea of creating a university to be able to

to actually train young teachers

who could...

international teachers who could...

spread the word of Budo (= martial arts) all over the world, so...

There was this idea behind the creation of the university,

but anyway it is a place where you can practice almost any Japanese martial art

I say "almost" because there was no Sumo club,

and there was no Jukendo club either.

which is my main martial art now, but,...

so you can do Aikido,

Naginata, Kendo, Karate, Shorinji Kempo, etc, etc, etc...

Kyudo... Judo of course...

So it's a kind of paradise for young...

Otaku, for young martial arts geek...

That is to say, for a foreigner anyway,...

it's very simple, it means...

you sleep... at the university,

you're always there,

and you can train from morning to night.

To give you an idea, at the time...

at least the first 2 or 3 years,

I was doing...

pfff...

thirty... well... thirty-five or so hours of martial art every week.

And not only Naginata of course,

But...

in fact there is such a... profusion of Dojo and practitioners

that you can be dragged very quickly in the Aikido club,

or the Iaido club, or the Kendo club...

Well, it's really...

As long as you ask permission and you get it,

you can really do whatever you want.

You have a rather phenomenal access to...

to the Japanese culture of martial arts

Not only through training,

but also... thank to the library.

It is something rather unknown,

but Katsu-Ura's univerity has a library about martial arts

that is really impressive,

and they have tons of archives, old books, old stuff, it's...

The whole knowledge of martial arts seems to be here, actually.

Besides the time spent in the Dojo,

I... kind of registered...

Well, we can say that,

I registered in Uozumi Takashi's class,

who is most probably one of the greatest,

if not the greatest researcher on Miyamoto Musashi

He's the one that wrote all the major books,

all the "hardcore" stuff about Miyamoto Musashi,

he's the one who wrote it.

And so he was a teacher at BuDai at the time,

and I spent... almost 6 years following his class.

almost face-to-face because he had such a bad reputation,

I mean his class was so hard,

and it was so difficult to pass the exam in the end,

that nobody dared to take it.

So it was a blessing for me

because I was almost... I was alone with him during the class.

Basically it was just for me,

a private lesson on Budo's history and Miyamoto Musashi, so...

In the beginning however I could barely speak Japanese,

so it was very complicated because he doen't speak English,

So for a year or two, I had to... hang on,

or I was getting an earful!...

Every ten minutes, because I could not read a sentence, a name or a Chinese character,

and he was using the board, there was no PowerPoint,

it was chalk and blackboard,

it was illegible, it was impenetrable, it was...

But in the end it broadens the mind, as we say,

and... after a year or two during which I really had to struggle to understand the matter

and to follow the martial arts... the history of martial arts like that...

with a lecture taught with a chalk,

he had a strange idea,

well he told me: "Now you can sort of read and understand Japanese,

- sort of -

maybe you could do something interesting,

like... say, translate something from Musashi that was never translated."

So I said: "Yeah, OK, great!

I think I'll never be able to do it but... let's do it!

So he proposed that... actually the Heiho San-Ju-Go Kajo,

which had already been translated by... er...

damn!... what's his name again, I forgot...

He's super famous. He won't hold it against me I hope... er...

He wrote a book about Miyamoto Musashi in French, wich is the authority,

and in which there is a partial translation of...

the whole Gorin no Sho is translated, but there is also a partial translation of the San-ju-go Kajo.

So it was the occasion to make a... more thorough translation and...

So I started it.

On the one hand I was practicing Naginata,

and when I was out of the Dojo I was burying myself in the book and the translation.

That's it.

I now remember the name; of course it's Tokitsu Kenji.

It's probably the pressure from the video cameras, I forgot... sorry!

But of course, his book is really famous in France

because it's probably the first and the most complete

of the books that have been writen on Miyamoto Musashi.

In France there's a kind of... how to say...

a rather romantic view of Miyamoto Musashi.

Well, a lot of people read La Pierre et le sabre and the second... La Parfaite lumière ("Musashi")

Well... those of course are novels

Don't...

Actually,...

Musashi, you have to know that most of the facts, rather alleged facts

that are attributed to Musashi

were never attested.

A good half is false, checked and false,

and the other half is unchecked, or even impossible to check.

So actually we don't know much about Musashi's life.

I found it interesting to translate the San-ju-go Kajo

because in a way it's... you can say it's the draft

of the Gorin-no-Sho, Le Traité des cinq roues (The Book of Five Rings), comme on dit en français,

And some ideas are the same,

exactly the same, and sometimes, some chapters are the same to the letter,

and on the other hand some ideas are completely absent from the Gorin-no-Sho,

and which are rather interesting.

I'm bragging now here, but to translate THAT,

and to write all the comments, it took me 7 years.

To translate took me 3 or 4... not even that. About 2 years,

because I was not doing it full time.

But afterwards, to actually make a book with it,

and make all the comments,

that took me a lot of time.

Finally we published it with Bunkasha International,

the commented French translation of the Heiho San-ju-go Kajo,

The 35 Articles on Strategy,

I was so happy when it was finally published,

now I don't have to open it ever again,

I don't want to hear about it.

At first, it was a personnal project,

and finally I sent it to a good friend, Sergio Boffa,

who is a History teacher, with a really wide knowledge of History,

and who is also a... let's say a RIGID university teacher.

Which means that he would check every word, every comma, every full stop.

So from a book that was ok but not great,

thank to him we made a book that, according to me, is really good.

I wrote a second book, completely different,

called "The Tales of the Samurai", by Miyamori.

I didn't write it, since it's a translation.

For those who are wondering, it has nothing to do with martial arts,

it's a collection of short stories,

short stories from about 1920.

Actually that guy, Miyamori, used to write books about Kabuki,

books for the general public, to help foreigners to understand...

what is Kabuki.

He used to write texts easy to understand, in English;

he used to write directly in English,

not in Japanese.

And he wrote that collection of 8 short stories, if I remember well.

One winter evening I was deeply bored,

I was in the Alps,

next to the fireplace,

and I thought: "Hey, I've got that book in english,

I have nothing to do",

there was nothing on TV,

my GameBoy was broken,

I thought: "Let's translate Miyamori's tales."

reduces the body a bit necessarily ... so find... a beautiful Japanese website and translate it yourself, it's better.

Okay, let's get back to martial arts university. I was there for about 7 or 8 years

Focusing primarily on the Naginata, but also at a certain moment,

I did a lot of, well I did a lot of Aikido and a lot of Budai too. Not to do Aikido itself,

but rather ... in a .... how can I say that?

a kind of personal research to be able to understand what is done in different martial arts

because Naginata and Aikido really have nothing in common, so to say

but try to understand and improve the understanding of what we do by going round the moon and in the end to see the

what happens on the other side in different martial arts and see if it does bring us a certain illumination. I find it ... 202 00:21:21,16 --> 00:21:22,68 it's important, I do not think that ...

I think, there are people actually who are quite voracious, but like all young people since it was the same with me when I

came to Japan. There was Naginata yes there is Naginata, there was Kendo yes, I will do kendo,

there is Kudo, I will do Kudo. And then the end of the day I would do five different martial arts. And I think at the beginning it's a good thing... it's a good attitude.

You have to do everything, because when you are in Japan, you often have a limited time. Ye know that you will be there maybe a year or only two years,

and after you leave Disneyland... it's the return to reality of your country where you come from. And so while you are in Disneyland,

I think you have to do all the attractions. And so, for two years I

I did exclusively Naginata.

But who says Naginata says old school ... so Tendo, which is one of the biggest ... school so to say

for Naginata, but also Ishinryu. I did a lot of Ishinryu in Tokyo when the Sensei was alive, he died unfortunately.

I also did some Homo Aito to relax during the weekends

With no disrespect but to explore other things I did some Yagoshi Kageryu during my time there

and a lot of Aikido. Also, at the martial arts university we have Kanazawa Sensei,

, Kobayashi Sensei and then the Tatsiki sensei who takes care of the club from day to day.

We have, we have well know names, so I say just take everything.

Et if there was Sumo I would have probably done some Sumo.

But however, that is just great in the beginning because

it really allows you to have really different opinions and ways of thinking

and then little by little, I think it's good as you get older,

to reduce and focus on one thing in particular not forgetting all that others practice.

And all that the other Sensei and disciplines could bring us,

and actually, trying to keep these alternative points of view to enrich one's own practice.

so you would say so he finally focused on the Naginata and in fact not at all.

Because in fact along the way, I came across a little by chance on Jukendo, which is the art of the bayonet. So

So, it's a little scary in the begining but that's the way of the bayonet. 226 00:23:52,18 --> 00:23:56,24 And the Tankendo which is actually the associated martial art, which is the bayonet fight with the hand or the knife.

And so finally I gradually I deviated from Naginata but keeping it still very present

and I reoriented myself a lot to Jukendo and Tankendo.

So yes because I was asked the question,

apart from this book on Musashi in which I put my all to try to have a good and precise results

in any case or the most precise possible and easy to understand while being as faithful as possible to the original.

It's true that after I wrote a second ... well before ... well at the same time,

I wrote a second book that had nothing to do with this. It was the story of Miyamori's Samurai

I do not write it, it's actually a translation.

And so for those who ask themselves the question this has absolutely nothing to do with martial arts.

This is a collection of news not fundamentally good either. It's news that dates back to 1920, I believe.

Actually this guy Miyamori is a guy who seemed to write books on Kabuki, vulgarization books.

To give a better understanding of Kabuki to foreigners.

He did doing things a bit easy to understand in English, he wrote directly in English. And he wrote this collection of eight news if my memories is good at 8 years old.

He did not write in Japanese. And so on a winter evening

I was very bored in the Alps by the fireplace.

And I thought, well, I have it in English, I am bored, there was nothing on TV,

my Gameboy was broken, soi said to myself I will translate the stpries of the samurai of Miyamori.

So I like doing research, I like writing articles and everything,

on the other hand, I do not think I have a level of literature that is insanely good. So, it's not Zola, it's not ... it's not Molière

I think the final result from a linguistic point of view is probably mediocre.

But, yes it was fun to translate and it was nice to read as well.

If you do not know what to do on the beach in summer, tales of Samurai go for it. But that's it, it's absolutely not a research thing.

I really enjoyed myself and it will probably not be in the annals of French literature, 252 00:26:31,45 --> 00:26:33,25 I won't go to the academy with it.

Yeah it is a great book even for the kids, it's great to read.

That's about all I had to say about this episode of my life.

We have been talking about martial arts for quite some time now.

Another side, another aspect of my life is the arts.

I did some music,

I have been doing martial arts since I was a kid but I did Judo etc.

And but also a lot of music.

I attended a Faculty of Musicology in Montpellier.

In Paris they called us the Faculty of Palavas those bastards.

Because when you say that you did music in Montpellier,

the guys would say spare us.

So not only did I make music in Montpellier, my friends

but I did "golf option".

And that's some tough stuff.

So to say we were really serious at the time.

And so music is ... and arts in general is a very important aspect of my life.

I am an artist myself I do not know if we can define it as an artist

but I live partly from painting but really partly.

I also live partly from music and partly from martial arts.

So that's a sort triad which is interesting.

I do not make a living from golf, too bad.

I think I would have made more money but ...

When I was at the university of martial arts,

I did not necessarily have a lot of resources.

Obviously, I had some money like that coming from France.

But it just served to buy the madeleines.

So I had to do, I did a little music but good Katsura is far from Tokyo

You can hardly sell anything so it was complicated.

So I had to find a part time job

And so because in Katsura since there was the martial arts university,

there is the Bogushop or the Budogushop that is the store for Judo guide,

belt, armor, weapons, the store

for those with a passion for martial arts and who do not really look for .... Not really anyone ...

They did not necessarily need an employee

but they had a website where they were selling armor at the time, mostly Kendo stuff.

And at the time it was Michael Komoto who was in Kendo doing a lot of things.

Il était coach de l'équipe Russe.

He was, he for cared a lot for foreign students at the university.

So, a very good level of Kendo and he was the one who also took care of the store.

But he was a little, I do not know, he wanted to leave this side of his activities.

So, I begged him for some time

and I took his place.

So my job was to sell on the internet

Kendo stuff: armor Bokken, Chennai and others.

But it's true it was interesting, it gave me some money

but I just love the idea to learn like we say

faire de la recherche et things like that.

And I took the opportunity to learn how to repair first of all my own armor. 306 00:30:11,28 --> 00:30:11,17 Because those armors go through a lot,

when you do thirty-five hours of Naginata or Kendo or whatever you want a week, the armor, the protections, 308 00:30:19,03 --> 00:30:21,60 the mask, the gloves, all that, it goes through a lot.

So, you still have them repaired often.

So rather than paying someone to do it, if I could repair them that was going to be great.

So, I started learning to repair the sides, i.e. the Kendo gloves.

And then I started learning how to fix other stuff.

And as time went by I has an interest for the "dos".

The "dos" is the breastplate of the armor.

They are now mad of plastic.

But at the time was bamboo.

A long time ago it was simply bamboo, and then recently about

fifty years back maybe more, a little more than 60 years we started having on top of the bamboo, 319 00:31:07,79 --> 00:31:13,05 a layer of buffalo leather.

And on that layer of buffalo leather we started to lacquer,

doing lacquer.

And so we had many traditional lacquer techniques that was used for bowls and stuff like that

On the armor, actually the Kendo armor has a very interesting artistic side.

And so, I was quite passionate about these breastplates, by these "dos".

So I also learned to mount men and masks and do almost everything.

So it's a job that is very very complicated, very difficult physically.

Because you have to break through piles of thick leather, futon and so

it's a very ungrateful job, sewing of the different parts.

On the other hand, the "dos" is not so difficult and in addition it is really interesting.

It really has an artistic side that was of interest to me.

So, I went to Kyoto to Mr. Tanaka

who actually runs an armor lacquer workshop called Kyotocho liu Do.

which was very well know a long time ago.

His father was well known.

Nowadays it's true that unfortunately

people are no longer interested by the traditional aspect of the armor and everything.

So we often buy plastic armors worth 300 euros, which are good, they protect.

But it is true that there is no longer the traditional art and traditional craft.

Not only because these armors are expensive and it is true that Kyotocho liu Do armors,

"dos" in Kyotocho liu Do, we see them less often.

But it's really beautiful lacquer work and it fascinated me a lot. So, I went to, not to learn with him

because that would be too much too say. I stayed a day or two he gave me plenty of tips how to do this,

how to do that

And so, I took back all his advice with me in my suitcase,

and I moved into the store in Katsura and started doing my own "Do".

So in the beginning, it did not look like much

it was pretty shabby, I must admit that it took me some time.

But progressively, and again I used lacquers of very poor quality.

I remember the first, the first that I really made

which looked like a "dos" I was so happy.

I gave to a foreign student who was there at the Faculty, Rodrigo he was from Chile.

I knew because he like all the Japanese in the Dojo, they liked hit on him

because he had a big mouth.

He made a lot of noise.

So, people loved to hit on him.

That was perfect! That way we will be able to test the resistance of the bazaar.

The "dos" it lasted 15 minutes and it

just broke into pieces, the lacquer was gone and it was a total failure.

It was a massacre.

But it's good because we learn from our mistakes and so I studied why the lacquer had not held.

And progressively, finally I got better to a point that after a while there was the "dos" made in Baptiste Tavernier,

or made by Baptiste Tavernier was on high demand from interested circles. And so that

And Messire Alex Bennett has his "Do" made by Tavernier, a beautiful « Do » by the way. I was very proud of that one.

Senseis from Naginata relatively known as Ebisawa Sensei or Suzuki Sensei they have their "Do", Suzuki as a matter of fact made him a "Do" in Anaconda skin.

something that gives it the work

but be careful, it is no joke.

An old Anaconda skin that had been brought back from Brazil

before the Washington convention on animals. So, it was legal. We did not break the law.

That's a "dos" that when he enters into the Dojo he is noticed obviously.

What I like most was the "dos" without any skin or anything, the ones just in wood. just with plain bamboo.

I did many of them, I did a lot maybe fifteen or twenty.

And students have some, Sensei have some. That's how it fed me for a few years.

I don't make any again because I no more have the tools, I don't have time,

I don't have all what is needed. I look back at this period with a lot of nostalgia.

And that taught me a lot of things with respect to Kendo or Naginata or Jukendo

i.e the respect for the armor that is disappearing.

That is to say back in the days the armor was something that nevertheless, because of its price was revered in the same way as the Shinai,

or the Son Bokken ou son Katana.

So that was something that was taken good care of.

You had to take good care of it because if we did not take care of it, it deteriorated very quickly. If you took care of it, it could last for years and years.

I have armor pieces, it's been ten, fifteen years that I use them.

Well maybe not fifteen but at least ten and they are almost like new.

But yes, you have to take care of it every day and it's really the top of armors.

It is true that now, we often find armors at three hundred, four hundred euros

We are done training, we swing them in the trunk of the car while waiting for next week.

So, the utility side is unchanged, why not?

But it's true that it's a shame, this culture of armor that is disappearing, it was better before like the elders would say.

But now we must follow the new trend.

A little nostalgia

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