Potentially if you're open to it use it for the YouTube channel if you're
comfortable. I'm comfortable, hopefully I'm a good guest I don't know. I think it'll be interesting
let me just set this room up real quick thanks man yeah you know I've seen you on Youtube, it's funny it's
funny I'm starting this YouTube stuff but now I'm actually able to talk about
it with other people because nobody that I've met physically or is able to you
know we can't have a full-on conversation about licensing and it's
been it's interesting now that a lot of people were reaching out and I'm talking
and meeting with a lot of cool people all around the world
well I I think it's pretty simple or I like to explain it as just melting ideal
to a company I'm gonna make it and I'll just pick right royalties is we're
pretty much about money yeah so looking at what can I help
answer
yeah for sure, so first of all thanks for tooking a call I appreciate it, like its, I dont know
any about licensing world, I feel like, you know I've got through the book
the idea but, definitely follow Steven Keys, the god of licensing
I know different things trying to figure out, watching videos, watching your videos, it's great
So, I feel like I've got to general grasp on it, I review few details that I feel like important enough
just to talk to somebody, get to understand that about. uhm, so
I don't quite have a grasp on the whole idea of having of course you know
we've red on the book that you just application is sufficient
but then you and a lot of others don't even have that when they reach out to companies
And, I guess I'm wondering, I'm not really afraid of them stealing the idea
work exactly like do you just you just like have an idea agree that sell sheet
just send it out yeah so with the PPAs more than 90% of the ideas I have to
admit I don't have a I don't file a PPA form it because most of them tend to be a
little bit more on the novelty side like they're just kind of whimsical
interesting things but like I've I've done a few for ideas where I think are
it's new it's definitely has potential it's kind of a game changer if I think
of it as a great idea then outgoing for a PPA for it but most of the ideas that
are happened more your psyche yeah I just said I'd rather just go and put it
out there and have it be the first product out on
the market rather than needing to weigh you know however long it needs to get a
PPA to come through so I yeah I'd rather put the put the product idea out there
first and if it means not filing out the PPA right away then that's
just how I did and I think Steven key and Andrew and on their invent right team
YouTube channel they also mentioned that like 90% of the students themselves you
know they really the coaches that they see and the students don't actually file
PPA's they just go and hit companies up right away but it's still good practice
I think to fill out PPA's especially the more you do it the better you get at it
and you know if you're able to just come out with a bunch of ideas and fill out
PPA's really quick and you have a little bit of coin to you know to get the PPA
then yeah and why not it doesn't hurt I I do like the
protection and I save it in quotes protection because it doesn't really
give you protection it gives you a perception of an ownership but with
patents they don't really give you protection they just give you the
ability to attack if someone infringes upon that patent and I like that it's
it's it's good to have that but you know it takes a lot of work for them to steal
patents and it's a lot it's a really scary thing to be on the other end of getting
attacked yeah so most of the time I don't know I don't even know
worried about them stealing my idea there has been one or two times where it
has a push accompanied with an idea and they dig straight up just like take the
concept of it but the execution was a little bit different and but it was also
one of those like Chinese manufacturers that was as a good hard lesson learned
and but mostly time I just hit him up you know send a sell sheet over and if
they're interested in the idea go if not they'll just tell me why
and then dope and then I move on to the next company and and also having that
like that patent pending on it it does give a little bit of a little bit of
like the light would be well it's like it's a leverage tool when you're in the
negotiations I don't know how much of a leverage it has depending on you know
how you deliver it or whatever of course it's something that they're looking for
that it can help like you know if if you got patent pending or job patent
definitely with patents you could use it as leverage just like alright the panel
advocates are the owner dirty owned yeah I need to get a higher royalties to use it
that you know but with patent pending sort PPA's I'm not sure how much on the
other cheek used because I just never have well he's never in that position to
use it as a leverage but a potentially can be I don't know
I see, Okay so then do you not patent pending then if we dont have PPA on it, dou you still put it on sell sheet
no I just removed it I don't I don't say it unless I actually applied for it and got a proof
that way I dont wanna get into crazy illegal trick
Okay, cool then, so one quick thing in terms of specific about PPA, you're experience how long it would take to get approved.
I'm trying to figure out the timeline of like submitting them also reaching out to companies
you know im just trying to like get my head around it the timeline
Yeah at most it was like around three months and it could be as early as three weeks
and yeah I would say around three months at most and if they if they require a
little bit more information sometimes they do go and mail you that and then
you have some time on top of that to put it on yeah so about three months at most
and that's that's really good compared to getting a a non-provisional patent
which is a traditional patents those take around three to four years for you to get approved
three months in most is not that bad
yeah for sure, can I ask you personally learned to write that
im finding that learning tool right non-provisional patent application
it sort of this like really big like this
I dont know if its good enough its confusing to think about it
they say all in the descriptions if you dont include like they always get include ABCD details about it
but company can take that and just not include D just A B and C and then they could
there's a strap with a buckle does that mean somebody can do everything to me an idea the same
exactly mom at my home and they get in since I'm not quite understanding the
variations yes yeah well writing the PPA I still have a lot to learn about how to
write it properly and yeah there were some articles some things that I found
I'll do just online research you know imagine this and this amazing so I I'm
still learning that part and I have to admit that I don't know the answer yet
but that's kind of the purpose of this YouTube channel is that I'm actually you
know documenting the process on it so with PPAs
without getting too crazy into it I would just off the research that you
find online just use that information for right now and right you know just
see what comes out of it when you write it together and then you put together
your sketches I don't know the exact rules around the drawings as well and I
don't want to say something that's gonna like you know if someone's like yeah
that's not right so I don't know I that's without it to say yeah but you
know stuff like that I'd write it as best as you can and you
know from all the research stress that you find just plug in all those things
and then just go and submit it and I would try to just move on you know
move as fast as you can and the whole the whole the whole goal with you pocket
ideas is to be there first on the shelves right so do whatever you gotta do you
know take your time be mindful but don't rush it the go you know as fast as you
can to get through here and yeah companies can add on top of that and
they can say they can you know they take the core principles of your card product
concept and then they just put something on to it where they could own it and
yeah I'm not sure how to avoid that and it's more of like the way that I'm
approaching things is that if like if I find a company that is stealing my ideas
or is known to be stealing ideas I'm just gonna you know share here and tell
a bunch of people put it on Facebook and Twitter and Instagram and go on the
forums and I'm just telling her like hey do don't these guys are not cool
this they steal ideas and here's proof of that email and all that and so yeah I
want to you know trip up too much it you know I'm not gonna say that it never
happens it does happen but I don't think it happens as often as people think it
does if we are mindful about the people that we're hitting up or the companies
that you're hitting up but you know the interesting thing with putting patents on
top of the panel and not mentioning something you could always especially
with provisional patent or ppas you could we write it or add and you want
you've beat your you no benefit whatever on top of it and you get another from I
don't know if it's from either that day or at the end of it of that one year you
got one of your patent pending you get another year so you could you could
continue you could continue to add stuff and then I'll give it extends it but as
long as you add or evolve what you know keep on the pot I like let's that's what
I know of I don't know the exact language or the words to explain it but
you there's a way for you to actually extend it a year and when you add
something on top of it invent right some of their short you
know videos they've got their IP an IP attorney I don't know if it's there I
fight the attorney or some other guy that but like t he talks about it and
the different dressing a good corners but overall I would just try to you know
try the bed right write it as best as you can but don't spend too much time on
it because most of the time there's no should be spent on hitting up companies
and then finding companies that are interested in that idea then we go
shooting with those companies and then move on to the next idea you want to get
rid of this site or get this idea out there and move on to the next idea and
then you just repeat
cool that's perfect man the answers a lot of course that one one last thing
and that is
this so just some of the process negotiating
with the company relative to them so specifically let's say there's a person
little question those that you don't do you eventually get it or do you just
kind of make a deal does a company asks especially for those kind of novelty
things do you ever get one or it just meant even that bad yeah so so the
product that I you know like to use as a case study and the YouTube stuff is the
mini back scratcher and they I didn't have a I didn't file a PPA we talked
about the patents and negotiation actually we can't really talk about I know it's
mentioned in it but I would I wasn't as thorough of reading through the
agreement cuz there's just a lot it was a very crazy time but later on they hit
me up saying okay we're gonna be taking the patent taking care of the patents on
this plane for four years and I became in the US market European market and
he's trying to China market I believe those are the main markets that they
file patents for and I get inventor credits and stuff like that and that was
a case where you know the company's most likely are gonna be filing for a patent
because I've heard of her cases where companies they recognize that the
products that they have just don't have as long of a lifecycle so rather than
investing a lot of my getting a patent and waiting three to
four years on a patent let's just go and file a PPA and put a patent pending on
it and then every year at the end of that one year they either add something
new to it or they just reapply and then they continue that continue to say
patent pending until the patent life cycle ends and that way they're not showing
out thousands and thousands of thousands of dollars for a little patent that's
eventually a lot for a product that attention they died few years down the
road
yes so yeah okay well that's that's the thing with open innovation is that you
know these companies like Procter & Gamble I like to use Procter & Gamble as
an example because they're just huge company right more than 80 percent I
mean I more than 50 percent of is that 80 I know it's definitely over 50% and
maybe 80 I can't remember but it's definitely like more than 50% of the
products that come through outside of the outside of their doors
ever since 2008 so these companies companies they they stay alive
especially like these really large ones - they stay alive by continuing to put
new products out there and always be the first ones to put these really cold need
you know products that way they stay in the gym and they stay at the top of the
game and they can't we can't or they have a higher chance of having these
really big game-changing products if it comes from everybody around the world
now if they build up the reputation of stealing ideas with PnG let's say they
stole an idea that you I'm not saying that they are they do but let's just say
that it happened and we got all this tools YouTube and Facebook and Twitter
and just you know all these forums and groups and be like hey don't don't send
ideas to discuss all of a sudden all the people that were sending ideas to them
they stopped and they sent it to Unilever instead now Unilever gets all
the new ideas and P&G doesn't so because of that bad rep of stealing ideas and
not getting credit or not paying the people that came up with the
ideas so there's that part to it what was the floor there's another
question you're asking that if you can remember just that well yeah so that is
that and also they want to continue to have new ideas coming in especially if
you're a person that always is just like alright here's a bunch of ideas and then
they say no to a bunch of them but they're really digging that you're
sending them ideas since like a company yes and there's more ideas and we'll
definitely take a look at it so they want to build up that
relationship or that's at the end of the day that's what it's a good licensing
relationship that they have respect for both sides of the party and it's a
winner you know it's it's a partnership it's a team teamwork young you want to
treat they should be treating everybody with respect and you know I've treated
with them with respect so the most messed up thing that they can do the
disrespectful thing is just through good idea and okay if you steal my idea then
I'm never sending you guys ideas again all right I'm not gonna go to your
competitor instead I'm just saying I'm a bunch of ideas because we're kind of
excuse it looks like you screw people over by taking their ideas yeah but this
there's also like for the product concepts that you do come up with now
there are some things that you have to be able to push conceptually that they
their own team wouldn't have been able to think of so
one of my vent life coaches his name was Howie he he was like I'll show him a
bunch of his ideas and then years ago yeah these are great whatever they like
that is the pretty fun ideas but for these they're aesthetically they look
fun or whatever and but what's them what would you say if the company responds
with like so what we could do this why do we need to pay you two because it's
like oh we could just print that ourselves why it looks like nothing new
so there's our responsibility as a product developer inventor or whatever
you call ourselves I like to just call myself as a product creative because
it's like to create products but they they need to be conceptually pushed took
to a little to a point where like a lot of people haven't thought of it and just
imagine their own R&D or research and development team hopes you know they
that's their full-time job every single day come up with ideas and whatever
let's say it's that and what is something that they can never give and
that is that's kind of my way of getting around you so what is that the idea is
so you were fresh and just unexpected that so what is not even part of the
question edge it's more like how do we get this how do i how do i license this
idea from you that's that's the ideal question that I like to do
actually first up is actually having an idea yeah yeah I something sounds yeah
someone could always make things look pretty but there but the concept behind
it the benefit what is it actually you know providing those are all things that
we need to think of it's a responsibility to push it and it might
be tough in the beginning for a lot of folks that are kind of new to just or
they're not used to coming up with a bunch of ideas and the more you do it
the better you get at it it's like a muscle there's your brains and muscle
right and we got to work it out and then asking that question to yourself is
definitely rare it's good practice or good like
okay yeah oh that's a great question so it's just it depends on how you
negotiated so that's like the ideal perfect scenario situation where and
they could that's that's that's kind of the case with kicker limping or the back
scratcher like I didn't pay for that they pay for
it that's something that we kind of happened after and
again inventor credits and all that fun stuff so usually if you know it's just
how you negotiate it other ways of doing and he's like ask all right it's like
okay you're not gonna be able to pay for this pen but I would like you guys to
you know I see us being great licensing partners for this product idea so and
rather than rather than me paying for it why don't you this is not how I would it
were date exactly but why don't you pay it in advance and then you use that
advance money to pay for the pad and we could just tell them like yeah okay so
if you could since you guys aren't gonna be paying for the pen then I'm gonna be
asking for our events because if you want this thing to be patented I'm gonna
need a little bit of capital to going and that's what the events is going to
be useful and not for me just mess around with it you know another another
possible way I'm I think that I'm just kind of thinking off the top of my head
if I was in that kind of position then I could just be like well instead of doing
a traditional pen how about we'll go and do a provisional patent application you
know patent pending on it every year
that way you don't have to pay whatever it's like that you could pay for it and
yeah you can negotiate something like that I I don't know if that's the best
way to do it again that's just yeah an idea that just yeah I'm just talking
another thing is that let's say they don't give me an advance and they don't
give you they don't purchase the patent so you
have to purchase the patent yourself and you're like okay this is something that
I could it's worth investing in because if this company doesn't work out then I
could always go to another company and I have the ownership to the pad
you know ownership to the idea but for but for that first initial company you
can negotiate all right you guys aren't paying I'll pay for it but it's gonna be
a higher royalty percentage
how about you pay for it but like 5% lower royalty or something like seems
like that would incentivize that if I pay for it yeah yeah yeah long run it
might be worth it because we have the ownership to that idea but yeah it all
depends on how you negotiate it and everything is all up for negotiations
which is you know it's a mindset but you got to happen to approach this and yeah
ideally we love your idea so much that they'll be like okay what we'll take
care of it whatever that as long as you continue to work with us yeah let us
continue to do it okay that's good so but in the beginning it's just like dead
get there you know getting to the doors get talked to the people said give them
the idea have them actually responded yes or no and nothing there see where
that conversation goes on you know all this stuff is like more of a
hypothetical and I always use this phrase and analysis by paralysis and
whenever we're thinking too much about we want to be prepared
but eventually thinking too much is gonna stop us from actually doing it and
we wanted we're doing rather than thinking but these are really great
questions and you know yeah hit me up on skype and you got you have my contact so
let me try and then if you're on like the Facebook group I don't know if
you're on the Facebook group and that I'm trying to be a little bit more
active in it it's been a lot lately I haven't been spending as much time as I
knew to it's true but definitely there and then
responding to all the comments and messages it does take a little bit of
time too because there's so many coming at me at the same time yeah but you got
you got this Skype and the Facebook definitely is worth with having putting
a conversation or putting a dialogue on there and asking other folks to cuz
there's people that definitely know a lot more than I do
yeah that's what I got alright great selling is great chatting with you Mikey
and I look forward to chatting with you sometime soon
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