Are you a funnel hacker? Do you do funnel hacking? If so you might be losing more
money than a not-so-bright gorilla playing the cryptocurrency game
hey what's up everybody this is the inaugural podcast of the we live
marketing podcast I am Karma Senge and I am Eddie Sand. what's up Eddie how you
doing buddy was going on congratulations man
the new podcast yes congratulations to you you're part of it too yeah this is
exciting this just happened to it just happened this is the best part of this
it just happened yeah you know I've wanted to do this for a long time more
than a year and you know before that I actually had a really successful podcast
the Supercharge Your Trading podcast and we were actually the number one currency
trading podcast in the world and you know ever since I did that you know I
wanted to create this marketing podcast and it just it never happened but you
know now now you know due to certain events happening here we are that's it
man and we love marketing so yes We LIVE Marketing oh that's right we love it we
live it that's right you know this is all we do you know all we do is market
market markets so let's talk about this funnel hacking stuff today because it's
out there it's still out there it is and you know what I don't know if
if you can see it but I actually wore a special shirt today funnel hacker on it you
know and you know I I wear this shirt on purpose is for this inaugural episode
but yeah let's talk about funnel-hacking you know what people think
funnell hacking is and you know the good aspects of funnelhacking the bad
aspects of funnel hacking I think personally I have a lot more bad issues
you know I have problems with this so-called funnel hacking you know
everybody's going around with but you know let's just sort of put what are
your thoughts on on for yeah all right so I think you're right so so just in
case people don't have a clue what final hacking is all it is is you're
really looking into other marketing sales funnels from companies or brands
in you reverse engineer their successful funnel if you find one but what's the
funnel what's the funnel so I finally may not know what if I so
yeah you're right you're right so the funnel look at it this way is a starting
point of you talking about your company to a potential customer and you take
them through a process so if you can imagine a funnel so they go into a
process through different levels until they make a purchase so they become
loyal customers to you or you come all right is that process you know that that
process is like different pages different products and so forth yeah
everything's starting from your ad that you're doing or a blog post you know if
you're doing things the old-fashioned way not using advertising and I should
say old old-fashioned you know because I still do like blog posts and so forth
but the non-paid method of organic traffic and you know all the way through
the sales process of them actually becoming a customer yeah so that that's
that's essentially a funnel and you know my big issue with funnel hacking is that
you know and I see it all the time in facebook groups facebook chats and and
all these different forms and so forth is that everybody all these
quote-unquote funnel hackers essentially believe that all you have to do is rip
someone off so what that already has you know a successful (Sales) funnel find them
essentially duplicate exactly what they're doing and and they're gonna be
you know rich and unfortunately it doesn't work that way you know and you
know you might be able to copy the the layout designs but you know there's a
lot of things that I see on the internet and online that
people are just outright copyright you know like they're just stealing yeah its
content not just the design of the layout or the idea of what this page is
doing or saying it is literally like word-for-word picture for picture layout
for layout of what these people are doing and yeah yeah to me that that's
just you know immoral like I I don't agree with that at all I once saw this
one person who is really happy that he did this book funnel and if you went to
it literally the only thing he did was change a few pictures from what Russell
Brunson (of Clickfunnels) had done with his book funnel like literally it was the exact same
word for word content that was on it maybe maybe a few words here and there
change but essentially it was he just swapped out pictures and that was it
yeah and I just I don't agree with that yeah yeah yeah no I'm with you I'm I
think you know that really comes down to having an understanding of what you're
getting into first right so so I what I've experienced is this
when people find a program a system like funnel hacking they immediately
immediately the word the word is just a mess if someone is not their mindset
it's not right because hacking what do you think hacking
you're stealing their silly something and you're hacking out your way into
creating what you want right all right so that initial introduction to final
hacking that right there I think most people you know subconsciously they
don't they don't understand that really is not hacking as it is reverse
engineering everything the studying and studying things exactly and that's the
problem is that these people don't understand that it's it's you're trying
to reverse engineer the process and the idea of what they're doing not copying
them and you know I I don't I don't blame you know like it was Russell
Brunson and the Clickfunnels gang that actually came up with this idea of
funnel hacking but it wasn't them it was you know people that were following that
that that took it wrong that right no idea became very obscured and and
convoluted that you know it was just became a let's just rip this person off
thing right exactly but again right it all started with that name and and so
what one linkage when you attempt to convince someone who is doing it who is
involved with what's the company named Russell's company Click funnels so click
follows an example right so when when people are involved with Click-funnels
and they have that concept with final hacking it's a little bit difficult to
try to get them to understand that look you you actually do have to work oh yeah
you do have to take time to study whatever it is that you're going to hack
right well quote you know study it research it study some more practice and
create your own not just oh I'm here to make money I want to become a
millionaire and get our little so whatever it is that they give away
and the quickest the better do you ever see that mean that was like you know oh
you know I put together my funnel you know two weeks ago and I'm still not a
millionaire I knew this was a scam you know like I was just laughing my hat off
I was like guess that that's it right there you know
yeah well okay so so we see so far the subconscious habit of reading hacking
and how that's gonna mess things up when you first start if you're not ready or
understand the other thing is what you said right it's like they're ripping
people off or ripping the brands or the company off right and then we come to
this third area where some of them are just like you said he's not working you
know like they almost think is an automated system where you just
understand frontal hacking and click a button and all of a sudden just go it's
just gonna work and no yeah put up fight put up five pages and I mean you put up
five pages in your you know easily make a hundred million dollars right exactly
not and so so you know I guess let's see if we can find something good how about
that you know because if that's the bad why would anyone want to actually do
funnel hacking well I understand the idea of funnel hacking and that is you
know supposed to be that reverse engineering you know going through a
person's because I've done it myself you know you know my mentor Frank Kern he
had this book funnel going and he still he still runs his book funnel and I
actually bought you know all the products and everything like that went
went through it but it was the idea of one I'm not gonna rip him off but I want
to understand what he's doing why he's doing it and how I can
engineer it for you know my business which is communauté at the time it was a
very completely different business but it was you know you have to understand
what they're doing and why they're doing it you know and and and that that's the
good of funnel hacking is that you know I I guess I could consider myself a
funnel hacker because I've done it and you know hacking of course is just you
know a term very very popular term nowadays but it's just it's just that
reverse engineering of the process and you know freight current being one of
the absolute best marketers Russell Brunson is as well and you know I've
gone through a lot of his funnels to make sure you know to see what he's
doing why he's doing it and so forth and I've
got some great great ideas from it but it's just that reverse engineering of it
study study study and research you know ask questions hey why did you do this
because I got us Frank that I was like hey why did you do this at this point
you know in your funnel why not have that second upsell you know why did you
do this why did you do that you know why is it why is your butt green instead of
rent you know you know all these different questions and that but that's
what it's about it's it's the learning process so that you can implement it in
your own way not let me just duplicate it you know right right so it's not
duplication its implementation of what you're learning and it's it's it's not
duplication its inspiration whoo oh you should write that down
yeah well I got a quarter that's a that's a that's a Twitter right there
okay so if you're watching right now go ahead and twit that so twitter twitter
twitter that's a twitter tweet it you know nothing about you know nothing
about Twitter D sweetie pío pío tweet three I don't care just
that's that's the twit for the day that's the trick
week there you go ma'am there you go I wrote that down it's not duplication
it's inspiration Bell beautiful alright so coming back to
what you were saying what what you guys are making right now yeah if you just
listen to what karma was saying and I think those are the key ingredients to
funnel hacking and we're going to keep using funnel hacking because that way
you know you understand the whole concept of it so number one I wrote it
down it's first of all you're doing it because you want to learn how how is it
done right so like what's happening you know and how are they doing this and
then the other thing is why right so so why are you doing this you know what's
going on what would you say why is it red in that green or vice versa yeah you
know if you only do if you only figure out what they're doing it really stops
the learning process once you've you know realize okay they have five pages
up they have an upsell they have a down sell they have a second upsell and then
a a page dedicated to get you to join the webinar like what once once you do
that and and that's out of the way the learning process stops mm-hmm you know
and you know it's it's the understanding of why mm-hmm did they set it up that
way yeah yeah and I think that's what we need to start with that's why cuz I
actually wrote what why how however I we should start with first of all what is
it that you're going to do what is it that you decided to go hack right
alright if you have an understanding of that topic subject or brand okay how how
is it that they're doing it because now you're focusing on how they're working
things around them you know how is it that they're communicating with their
customers their leads or whatever it is that you're you're looking at then why
why they do it right so I've seen a lot of post and let our advertising on
Facebook where as a matter of fact Frank right he did this he showed us why he
did it and it was that he had a picture of
himself like the surfer dude and then all the sudden he had a picture with a
very professional cut hair nice looking and and so he met he said that you know
he was the same dude either way but people were attracted to this one so why
why did he have two things out there well first of all he was testing but
other other thing he tested was that it was better for him to be nice dressed
then it was not too however the cool thing was that he said at the beginning
of his career the surfer do work just fine
oh thanks lutely right so so you know this is why you need to understand why
is it that you're now wearing this or that or or why is it that you're taking
a picture with your wife coming out of the plane or you know what I'm saying
like wow why they do that and then you get to what they're doing so now you're
getting to the reverse engineer okay like you said you know they've got five
pages earlier this up so here back in there the email comes saying you know
now you take a look at what they're doing and now you start your own and I
think that should be follow hacking not yeah absolutely and and and then on top
of that you know you mentioned you know back in a second ago you know that
that's something that a lot of these quote-unquote funnel hackers are missing
is this back-end you know they have the upfront funnel you know similarly it
could be like the tip of an iceberg right they they have the the front-end
funnel that top part of the iceberg that's sticking out of the water and
they're missing the entire back-end which is the big base of the the bulk
majority of the iceberg and you know if you make let's say you make a hundred
thousand dollars on that front end funnel you know you essentially could
potentially make ten million dollars if they just had a back-end but all they're
thinking is is you know this front-end funnel oh I've got a you know create
this you know lead magnet that sends them to you know a what they call
tripwire product don't don't like that term but that that's for another day and
then that's going to go to an upsell and then a downsell and then another upsell
and then maybe shoot you over to a webinar page and a thank-you page and
like that's it you know and they're like okay that worked you know great let me
go build another front and funnel for something else and you know you're gonna
make this much money a very small amount of money if you're doing that but you
need that huge never-ending back-end that that's what's really gonna make you
the money because you know most people if you try to sell them something what
is their initial reaction going to be don't give it I don't wanna be sold yeah
no I don't want that you know and and that's the point you know you know for
every ten people that come through maybe you sell one right but if you had a big
enough back in maybe you could get five or six more yep you know and that's the
thing with a lot of funnel hackers and his funnel hacky
mindset is that they're just solely focused on that front and funnel and you
know I find that very disturbing because I know from my own experience you know
I've been in business a long long time that I would say 90% of everything that
I've ever made has all been on the back end
mmm you know all been on I've made a lot of money and upfront you know those
upfront funnels but it's the back end that that changed my life that that you
know allowed me to change my lifestyle and and you know grow and that's what
people need they need those back and you know campaigns okay so what so just in
case you know we need to make sure that people know what back in in front-end
means because no they don't well you know because I could tell you this when
I first started I heard back and I'm like what do you mean the back at the
end like anything of what back yeah so so in real simple terms right back in is
practically your ultimate goal that you're taking your customer to to
purchase and then thereafter yeah absolutely you know keeping in contact
with them and that's not you know shooting a an email with a hard sell you
know once a month right it's it's that constant contact with them you know
constantly educating them you know taking them over to an education you
know video that you know might have a soft pitch to it and then you know if
they go to view that then setting up you know a countdown sequence which you know
will get them to you know maybe watch something else
and we'll pitch them a little bit harder and then you know repeated emails of you
know infotainment as been settle says it's that you know a little bit of
Education a lot of entertainment you know we like entertainment but it's just
that constant contact that you need to keep with them because eventually they
will buy you know I knew about Frank oh my god
years and years ago like almost 10 years ago I knew about Frank but you know back
then you like you said he had the long hair you know he was driving the van and
planned you know I was like honestly and Frank you know if you're listening I'm
so sorry around for you know Frank and I are friends and that was like I had just
asked myself you know how can I learn from this guy you know how could someone
light like that teach me you know I didn't know who Frank was you know I
didn't know he was the Frank Kern you know all I do is okay there's this Frank
guy and and he's supposed to be really good at this stuff but I just I didn't
resonate with him I didn't click with them and then years later I see him in a
suit haircut speaking and I kid you not I didn't even know he was the same guy
at first and then he was talking he mentioned something and I was like wait
a second that sounds really familiar so I went on YouTube and looked it up and
I'll say oh my god is to say god I was kicking myself I was like dude if I
would have listened to him years before when I first found him yeah knows where
I would be now I hear you I I think I got I got him talking about back in well
that before I say this I wrote it down so would you say that back end is the
engagement the continual consistent engagement to your list it is the
building the relationship with others
you know letting them understand that you can help them with their problem
that's cool that's cool that's really good so this is really good and I had to
stop there because my understanding when I first started
online marketing this was back in 2007 and in when I first started I heard
something like back in but I might bring I imagined that it was a specific
product of servers are back in that that was the end of my funnel and so in now
when we say back if this makes more sense than that and again I think that's
another word that we should change too because you know building relationship
is what it's all about in you talking about Frank Kern you're absolutely right
because I also met him when he was a surfer do it I interacted with it I
liked like you met him back then yeah because I actually liked him with
Trey remember Trey he's come yeah yeah good you talking about aunt in
fourteener right yeah okay he was them I think he was the master at that because
all I wanted to do was watch that next video with him and Trey and whoever you
know else was gonna get involved in the videos that they did dude now I now I
watch those and I'm just it's hilarious yeah I thought to say I don't make this
that this dude is so cool yeah but I think again I got so caught up with who
he was and how cool the videos were because of his relationship you know the
building relationship eventually I ended up buying I think it was a camera what
was the first course that I got but it wasn't broken and then of course we went
to his a man and here we are you know so it was a transition the back end was the
engagement the build a relationship that he kept going and going and you know
here we are so it the back end it and I actually in my own personal terminology
I call it a continuation pipeline I don't use the word backend because it's
continuous yeah like my my quote unquote back in
never ends right ever ever ever ends you're gonna be getting an email for me
you know every day for the rest of your life unless you opt out and even then I
might call you baby I hate God I'll give you a special offer but you know that
that's what it's about and you know I remember Frank saying something like he
had some people that were on his list for like eight or nine years that had
never bought a single thing from him mm-hmm and then like nine here eight or
nine years later they bought one of his like big courses and so forth I was like
that's what the backend is for it's you know and I've had a similar thing
although it was only like two years had gone by I had someone following me for
two years and they they would you know email me from time to time ask me a
question and of course I just reply back to them
I'm not gonna be that that person that you know doesn't reply because they're
not a customer you know no I always reply to you and and a couple of years
go by and finally they bought my course that I was selling only because I
continued to nurture that relationship and it's not you know I am NOT a
believer in just providing content and nothing more
you know in my in my continuation or emails all right in every single email
you can verify this you've seen my emails every single email I send out I'm
selling something mm-hmm George or not sure yep yep every time
every single time you you will not get an email for me for anything without
trying to sell you something but it's very soft so you know it's it's here's
this cool you know story of you know what happened to me today with my you
know Facebook ad and this is the lesson that that I learned from it that you
could you know take away as well oh and by the way if you'd like to learn
more here you know here's a link blah blah blah
right right so it's that soft cell but every single email you know I'm
constantly selling because if you don't then I don't fully believe that you are
helping the person to the best of their ability to the best of your abilities
right right if you really believed in your product you'd be selling it like
like crazy there nothing that you would do that you're not trying to picture to
someone that's right that's right so okay so back in right so we kind of
hopefully make sense now if you guys are still watching so I think listening you
know listen whatever you're doing so so if that's the back end if the back end
is like you call it a continuous pipeline which I like because it makes
more sense to see it that way then the front end is the beginning right if it's
a continuous pipeline the beginning the starting point would be what well that
that front end you know what Franken and actually I called it you know before the
line and behind the line right before the line is everything that comes prior
to them purchasing something right and yeah that could be you know your
advertisement or a blog post a podcast like this or YouTube video you know this
is this is also gonna be on YouTube and you know that could start the process
it's that awareness of who is this person what are they about how can they
help me mmm right and you know everything through your first initial
funnel right so that that funnel you know maybe they learn about you maybe
they read a blog post and then maybe they read a second or third block bus
and then finally they say oh I'm gonna sign up for that this person is giving
away 10 free tips to you know generating a hundred thousand dollars a month with
email marketing right and then they go and they sign up for it
and then you know from that point maybe that takes them over to you know an
offer of some sort all right that that your front end funnel and and so that
that's that's the front end you know everything that comes after that is the
continuation pipeline or the back end right right the the look that be all I
can tell you can see it yep there you go before the line and I'm either a beater
a okay so so that's good so the beginning and the there's no end it's
just a continuous thing really it's a bachelor funnel that just never stops
yeah so so you know what I just thought of the beginning I'm going to write this
down the beginning and the thereafter okay that's really what a funnel hacker
should be thinking about when they're hacking bim's
though the way or reverse engineer their way into creating their own funnel yeah
you know there's one funnel hacker that you know pretty much copied Ross one of
Russell Brunson's you know funnels and I actually like to see what he had done I
I knew he didn't do much but you know I bought into into his stuff IIIi got ass
course and the course is D so that you know it's not the best but it was pretty
decent and I got emails for like six whole days
after that I have not heard a single P hmm and it's like and I didn't buy
everything either right I bought the initial offer you know and you know not
I didn't get anything for you know a follow-up to the upsell or down sell or
anything like that you know IIIi got a couple of little emails for like five or
six days and then I've never got another email from them since and it's like oh
my god yeah that is the that is the easiest way to lose money to do your
sales yeah that that's why I said you know initially when we started this this
podcast that you're gonna lose money if your funnel hacking because that's the
way most funnel hackers do it yeah agree agree if you do it the way that we tell
you and you know maybe you do you know reverse engineer someone else is
funneled you create your own but you create you know very very good content
very very good you know continuation pipeline then you
know our quote unquote back-end as everybody calls it then you can make so
much more money so much yeah and so this is good so okay reverse engineer the the
value that you bring to the front of your of your funnel and the value that
you give thereafter with your continuation
pipeline like you mentioned so or continuous pipeline so so right there is
your fundamental your foundation your your your base that is exactly what you
should be looking at when your final hacking and you know can we name it
something else they would decide to name with something else no with a name
because you know just just to make things solid you know I'm not I'm not
big on a name creation of this type of thing yeah we could call it
I don't ask and now we'll come up with you know you know what if you come up
with another name post a comment under this video send us you know an email and
let us know what your thoughts are a different name other than hacking
although their final hacking that's right that's right because personally I
don't I don't like that term yeah so so yeah let's hear from us for real for
sure as a matter of fact you know the the let's see if we even pick one what
about that like we look at the comments and who knows if we pick one they can
get something from us right like yeah absolutely
I don't giving you something if we picked yours then you'll be recognized
with a special certain arm I will paint you Carmine's know to give away things I
are going to always give away stars like I'm always giving things as much as I
can so so we'll see we'll come up with something that would
be pretty cool so come up with a cool name that describes final hacking in the
terms the definition the description that we're giving you today yeah yeah
and I am I'm known for giving our prizes away and this and that you know I once
gave a trip to to Paris tip it to someone just because you know
I'm not saying that you're gonna get a trip to Paris but once you start posting
a whole bunch right away yeah yeah everybody and their mother should be
posting idea and we're gonna actually pick a winner and what we're you're
gonna get something yeah take a winner you're picking with it that's right it's
gonna be fun we're gonna make it fun yes so yeah okay so we we kind of dealt with
funnel hacking stuff and funnel hacker and why you're going to be losing money
because again it's not focusing on the right things but now that we share that
with you I think what can we actually give somebody right now that they can
say man this is info by I want to go ahead and start
implement something so what what will be like one one or two things that we can
give them apartment because that'll be a question that I would have if I was
listening to us what do you what do you mean give them so so getting this year
you have something other than the massive about just lay down on them like
no a mountain falling on them that's right that's right well because you know
they got it they got to see it to believe it kind of thing right so here's
what what it is we already gave you the reverse engineer idea we already gave
you the how why and what you should be looking at we told you that the back end
is actually to create and build rapport or engagement and to continually be
promoting what you believe in and bringing value to your your leads and
customers and so forth alright so we gave you all that so that's goal right
there now if you starting or if you already have a funnel hacking system I
guess if you want to call it our program um the next step for you right now is
you need to first I think you need to decide do you believe this I mean you
know don't don't don't like you say karma we're giving away so much but you
know if people just like you know they're thinking we're crazy okay you
know so first ask yourself you know do you believe it yourself don't just
believe it because we're telling you that this is how it is but you know do
you believe it you know came and then what you could do this is my
recommendation isn't that the Nugget I guess if they want to take something
right now is since we talked about building that relationship in the back
end I think you mentioned that already you got only six emails and that's it I
think what you want to do next is go look at your email sequence or write
your emails that you have and create some more yeah and create them with
value okay when I first met you I didn't know much about the you're following up
with people with email I kind of had an idea copy
and paste mentality right since I've met you I've got I'm after actually in one
just one sequence I'm up to sixty emails and but and how often the email people
how often like every other day I do it either every day sometimes every other
day the most space that I've gotten is three days in between you but that's
about it but what you want to do then is you know start with that I think you
should start with that look at your email and start adding and um if you
were to just add one email a day just one remember you do an email and you add
it you won't have to do that email again so in 30 days from now you'll have 30
emails 60 days from now you'll have 60 emails and if you want to stop there
that's cool you can create on your sequence but I think you want to start
with that first and and give that value in your email sequence and your email
follow-up yeah so that's what I have for them what about you what would you leave
them with I'm gonna leave you with you know kind of similar to what what you
did but with you know the 38 challenge of you know creating 30 days worth of
emails for people so that they have and it doesn't matter you know if you space
it out you know maybe two emails a week I don't like the whole one email a week
thing because people tend to forget about you you know a couple of emails a
week but do 30 emails so that you have at least you know 15 weeks of content
you know for me I email every day that's a whole other episode
and you know do this 30 day challenge and just literally get out there and do
it and you know I'm big in productivity and implementation and if I set my mind
to do something I jot out a plan and I just execute and you know I am
I go overboard when it comes to execution I just knock stuff out but
yeah just get out there and do it sweet man
dude that's awesome this is this is good stuff so remember you watching make sure
you comment I mean we're seriously this is this is
good good stuff good info and it helps all of us as entrepreneurs as marketers
it helped helps our field you know to learn a new word a new description how
nice yeah yeah so I'm thinking have submerge yeah real quick
where can people find you ready all right so they can find me on Facebook at
Eddie sand marketing so if you go to Facebook just go type Eddie send
marketing and you'll find my page you can also find me on on Instagram that's
another place that I'm at a lot and that is again same thing Eddie send marketing
you'll find it there as well awesome and you can find me at karma sengai
marketing.com and you can also find me over at youtube you just go to karma
sagen marketing.com /youtube and you'll find either so is
man right on yeah if you've enjoyed this episode you know go ahead and click that
like button hit subscribe and we will see you next time guys so take care hmm
bye bye
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